@Mick[There were hundreds of allegations of drugging and rapes in the
grotto at Hefner’s “parties.” Hundreds. But perhaps like you,
any female with a complaint was dismissed because it was assumed they were there
for one reason only.]Well then it's a good thing I don't
approve of Hefner anyway. My point was, in responding to someone who
argued that lefties only carried about the Hollywood Access tape because it was
Trump, that consent (specifically the lack thereof) is the thing that ticked
people off most with the Hollywood Access tape. Sub Trump out with anyone and
I'd still be disgusted with it.
This is a tricky subject to discuss in 1200 characters. Especially since the
Judeo-Christian standard has been ignored or abandoned by so many for so long.
Morality has always, always had those who made their own rules. And this cuts
across almost all groups of people. Trump is not my idea of a moral hero; but,
neither is Hefner, the Clintons, and others. Lately, there has been a lot of
''Pots calling kettles'' names.
Utahbluedevil-His attorney dumped him because it is Gloria
Allred’s daughter. Not good to have your daughter representing scum bag
predators while you “protect” his victims. And did you read his
confession/statement? He is a criminal and needs to go to jailI
really can’t believe you tried to defend any of Hollywood’s or
Weinstein’s action’sFrozen fract-There were
hundreds of allegations of drugging and rapes in the grotto at Hefner’s
“parties.” Hundreds. But perhaps like you, any female with a
complaint was dismissed because it was assumed they were there for one reason
"Let's be truthful, at the time of that tape Trump was a liberal
contributing to Democrats. He saw the light and became a Republican and since
then his lived a moral life."I missed this one.... that is truly
funny. And what was that date of this miraculous conversion? I think a lot of
missed that. Was that after his disgusting remarks to Megan Kelly about ....
never mind. I will admit, getting older does take certain lifestyle
things off the table.
In our opinion: Hollywood, Hefner and hypocrisy in the sexual revolutionYes - hypocrites...When Donald Trump learned that
then-girlfriend Marla Maples was pregnant with Tiffany, Trump said,
“Excuse me, what happened?” and “Oh, great”— Trump
said on The Howard Stern Show.“I’m glad it happened. I
have a great little daughter, Tiffany,” Trump told his pal Stern in the
2004 interview. “But, you know, at the time it was like, ‘Excuse me,
what happened?’ And then I said, ‘Well, what are we going to do
about this?’ [implying, getting an abortion][Marla] said, ‘Are
you serious? It’s the most beautiful day of our lives.’ I said,
Ah so funny so funny. I just want to hear one particular democrat, that keeps
telling us one of the reasons she loss, was misogyny, stand up and separate
herself from Harvey for what he has done over the years. And
don't defend her saying it is old news, she is still taking shots to be in
the party limelight. Her continued actions or inactions are fair game.
@Fred44 Trying to paint this as just a liberal thing won't work. In
addition to the President and his appalling behavior there is also the corporate
climate of Fox News where harassment seems to have been a daily thing coming
from the top.
Your article left out Fox News, which has been in a controversy just like
Weinstien except that he never preached family values.
@Fred44 "Let's be truthful, at the time of that tape Trump was a
liberal contributing to Democrats. He saw the light and became a Republican and
since then his lived a moral life."And you know this how?
@Joe - you asked.."If you are willing to stand up in front of a
crowd and loudly condemn Donald Trump or any other Republican for doing
something that you would give liberals a shrug for doing the same things or even
worse, then you are a hypocrite."But you do realize the man was
fired by the company that caries his name, campaign donations to democrats
returned to him, and his lawyer resigned from his employment. Sounds like more
than a "shrug". In fact it was a "liberal/progressive" paper
that broke the story. So not sure what you are referring to.Let's be clear, the last two years has exposed a generation of business
men that really abused their positions..... we have this man who has admitted
he acted improperly, and another that bragged about his exploits to a reporter
and on the Howard Stern show. One "Republican" ( I still say he
isn't a conservative ), and one a Democrat. Creepy old men are not the
sole province of either party.
Come on libs, using Trump and his Hollywood Access tape to say Republicans are
as bad as Democrats. Let's be truthful, at the time of that tape Trump was
a liberal contributing to Democrats. He saw the light and became a Republican
and since then his lived a moral life.
On the anniversary of the leader of the United States "Access Hollywood"
tape.....Why is there not more about Trump? There is so much
available about Donald Trump's sexual dalliances and abuse of women, as he
is interviewed by radio hosts, TV moderators, along with information in books
that are written about Trump.Why is Trump not discussed more as one of
the causes of moral decay and abuse of women?
@1covey"sounds as though if it were Hefner on the Hollywood access
tape, there would have been cheers instead of jeers from the liberals."No, because sexual assault is different from promiscuous consenting
relationships (which I still wouldn't cheer but the key difference is
Before feminism, men had authority over their wives, but they also had to take
full responsiblity to provide and protect for them as well. Back then women
never needed to worry about working or providing for their families. Their duty
was to nurture their children and husbands. This was actually a great life for
women. Abuse was dealt with and was rare.This is the natural way
men and women are designed to run a family. If you believe in evolution, we
evolved that way. If you believe in God, He made us that way.The
sexual revolution is just one of many symptoms of these tried and tested gender
roles being artificially perverted. Nations with egalitarian family laws and
cultures like the US have very high divorce rates, high sex promiscuity, and
don't even have replacement level population replacement.If you
want to fix the family, you return to patriarchal gender roles. That means
removing some privileges from women and returning family authority to men.
There is no other way.
@scrappy doIt's hard to sort out rape stats because reporting is
higher than it used to be and women have more rights these days. There
weren't even any laws about marital rape until the 1970s.
Hypocrisy means holding people you agree with politically to an entirely
different standard than the standard to which you hold your political
enemies.If you are willing to stand up in front of a crowd and
loudly condemn Donald Trump or any other Republican for doing something that you
would give liberals a shrug for doing the same things or even worse, then you
are a hypocrite.For the record, although I am a conservative I fully
support it when someone in the Republican party is exposed and thrown out of
office when they do something that I would be disgusted with if a Democrat did
it. Cosby, Weinstein, and Ailes have done some despicable things to women. They
and others like them should get the same kind of treatment. Send them to jail if
they committed actual crimes.The rich and powerful will always get
special treatment, but since the media became an arm of the DNC, it seems that
all liberals and Democrats get that same treatment.
Hollywood and hypocrisy are synonyms
Yes, there were men who treated women as sex objects before the Sexual
Revolution. But it was less. The reason I know is that is the feminization of
poverty became an issue in the late 1970's and early 1980's. The
feminization of poverty was caused by out-of-wedlock births. This happened
despite the Pill and abortion.The point of equality between men and
women is to get rid of the double standards that said it was for ok for men to
fool around but not for women. There is two ways that can go. 1) (Some) men
need to straighten up and be like the women OR 2) the women can fool around like
(some of) the men.We picked the wrong option which gave us this
stuff and the feminization of poverty. Somewhere I think that Hugh Hefner and
others were going, "If we get true equality then we can't make money
selling sex so let's co-opt it."While we are on the topic
what about the Steinhem Standard? When Bill Clinton messed with Monica Lewinsky
Gloria Steinhem, feminist icon, said it is ok for a male supervisor to
proposition a female subordinate just as long, the supervisor does not retaliate
for being turned down.I guess that has been finally thrown out.
Mom jeans says:"... unfortunately this type of behavior is
considered normal to libs."In case you haven't noticed, one
of the men mentioned was a Conservative, Anti-abortion, dyed-in-the-wool
Republican. @Mom jeans and scrappydoo;In case you
haven't noticed, CONSERVATIVES elected a man that completely fits the
description of "predator" to the office of President of the USA.Mike Richards says:"...we personally live our lives as
closely as possible to the doctrine given us by Christ..."---
When are you going to start? I've read your comments for a long while now,
and again, when do you plan to start?@L White;The OT
also commands us to stone adulterers and fornicator and eaters of shellfish and
wearers of mixed fibers. Should we do that?@Elsleuith;You left Trump out of your list.
This editorial correctly identifies crimes against women as a serious problem in
our society and then asserts a spurious claim as to its cause. Sexual predators
cause predation - period. Trying to tie it to anything else causes injury to the
efforts to protect the victims of these crimes.
Ah, the sexual revolution. The movement dedicated to seeking out lustful
desires at any cost, especially at other people’s expense.
Mom's jeans man is gone; Did you miss all the sexual harrassment lawsuits
at FOX News? Did you miss Tim Murphy, anti-abortion congressman,
telling his mistress to get an abortion.Did you miss Dennis Hastert
going to jail for his behavior.Did you miss Trump's hidden mike
interview. His handling of women?What about Larry Craig, Mark Foley
and Jerry Sandusky?So this guy disgraceful, how is this a lib only
To LDS Liberal: The editorial DID mention Tim Murphy.Please read it
all the way through.And, yes, the sexual revolution and "free
love" has a lot of grief to answer for.
@Maudine - it's always easier to blame "hollywood" rather than
taking personal responsibility for supporting things that don't match ones
own claimed values is always way easier. If it isn't Hollywood, then
its unions, or foreigners, or the big bad government. The ironic
thing about this article is Hefner's rise coincided with the fight for more
and equal rights for women. How much better to keep "women in their
place" other than to objectify them. When women started wanting a seat at
the table - a group of cigar smoking brandy swirling men decided they wanted to
create a club and magazine dedicated to casting women in a totally different
light. It was about the sexual revolution - but in a much broader context then
some cheesy magazine. It was trying to fight back the tide of equality - a
battle some from both sides are still fighting today.Hefner largely
lost his battle.... but the war is still raging on without him.
@LDS LiberalYou forgot to mention Bill Clinton.
This isn't a liberal/conservative issue. I'm not sure why people frame
it this way. People with absolute power will corrupt absolutely.
That is on both sides of the aisle, in every industry and on every continent.
This happened before and after the pill, before and after the sexual revolution.
Lds lib-That's the hypocrisy. Hollywood has never been the
"banner of sexual purity" but many of the actresses go after Donald
Trump for his indiscretions but won't say a word about Bill Clinton or
Harvey Weinstein or Hugh Hefner. (Ashlie Judd, Meryl Streep). Hollywood made it political, not about the true protection of women. The
liberal supporters get free pass.
The rape and sexual assault of women by powerful men has been going on for
millennia. This can hardly be blamed on the sexual revolution. That it is
hypocritical of the Harvey Weinsteins and Tim Murphys of the world to behave as
they did is true. But I don't think we can blame the pill or the decline of
marriage for rape and assault.
How would Hugh Hefner, Bill Clinton, Weinstein, or Cosby want their sisters
treated? Can we assume they wouldn't want their family members to be
treated as objects? That is hypocrisy. Unfortunately the media, Hollywood and
popular culture turn a blind eye to the "minor indiscretions" of many in
the news. It is refreshing to see someone stand for right.
@ L White: Huh?You stated that adultery was identified as a sin over
2000 years ago - when the Old Testament was written. This editorial
blames moral failures on Hollywood and Hugh Hefner. My comment says
only one of you can be correct - if adultery existed before Hollywood and Hefner
existed, than they cannot be responsible for it. Unless you believe in time
travel, adultery existed before the modern causes so many want to blame. At no point in my comment did I mention god, God, or gods. So, did sin - including adultery - exist before Hollywood or not?
The pill opened the flood gates at a time when the law of chastity was under
assault. Meanwhile radical feminists taught women that they are the same as
men, which previous generations of women knew was not true. The result has been
calamity for men, women, the family and civilization. New technology and new
morality cannot overcome the laws of Nature and Nature's God.
Bubble,Are you saying that the Ten Commandnents don't apply
today because God loved people enough 3,500 years ago that he didn't want
them to destroy themselves or their families? Or, are you saying that Hugh and
Harvey are gods? Unfortunately many people have no idea that there is a
difference between god and God. They follow whoever tells them what they want to
@ L White: Wait - did you say the Old Testament identifies adultery as a sin?
Wasn’t the Old Testament written over 2000 years ago?So - that
means adultery predates Hollywood and Hugh Hefner - so how can they be
responsible for the things this editorial accuses them of being responsible
for?I mean, I know Hefner was old, but he wasn’t that old!
People will always look to their heroes for guidence. My hero is Christ. As God
of the Old Testament, he instructed Moses to tell the world that adultry is a
grave sin. When he lived on earth, not only did he emphasize that adultry is a
sin, but that even thinking those kinds of thoughts is a sin. In our time, he
instructed our Prophets tell the world that marriage is only to be between a man
and a woman and that any type of sex outside of marriage is a sin.We
have a simple choice. We can align our thoughts and actions with Christ, the
savior of those who reject the "wisdom" of the world or we can align
ourselves with Hugh and Harvey. What authority do Hugh and Harvey have to make
eternal promises? Can they even restore trust for those who listen to them? Can
they repair broken lives, broken hearts, and broken families? Can they restore
dignity? Would you allow Hugh and Harvey to associate with your daughters or
From the comments, sounds as though if it were Hefner on the Hollywood access
tape, there would have been cheers instead of jeers from the liberals.
It seems to me that either we personally live our lives as closely as possible
to the doctrine given us by Christ and eloquently stated in the 13th Article of
Faith or we justify outright hated towards other based on prideful thoughts that
our openly displayed hatred is less damaging than acts committed by others.The devastation caused by magazines sold to embolden men to trivialize
women and the actions of Hollywood bigwigs on their casting couches will never
be fully known in this life, but, if we read between the lines, it's easy
to equate the destruction of millions was caused by those who preyed on
appetites and passions. The poison spewed by those people might be slower
acting than the venom of a rattlesnake, but in the end the results are nearly
the same. The snake causes great damage or death to the body. The other poison
causes great damage or death to the soul.
Sexual mores, of course, change with the age in which one lives. At one time,
polygamy was extolled as a virtue; now, it is not. At one time, certain
homosexual activities were criminalized; now, they are not. Thus, trying to
establish any standard of sexual conduct which all must follow at all times is
probably beyond difficult and a slippery slope on which we should not try to
We do have a really hard time with sex. The opposite sex is the object of
physical desire, but also a full fledged human being. The abuse of women
particularly is rife because we just can't get this straight. And it is
spectacularly worse in the so-called third world. The only way out is to
achieve equal power for women.
Keep in mind. This op-ed is written by a church owned newspaper that has zero
women in power positions (GA's).
How can Hollywood or Hefner be hypocrites?Hollywood has never even tried
to hold the banner of 'sexual purity'.A
"hypocrite" is someone who says one thing, and then does the polar
opposite.Like Donald Trump.
In our opinion: Hollywood, Hefner and hypocrisy in the sexual revolution====== No -- What is hypocritical is the Deseret News
singling out "Hollywood and Hefner", and giving NO mention of:Donald Trump - President of the Untied States - and his "Access
Hollywood" tapes, or Rep. Tim Murphy who spent years in congress
fighting abortion, and sponsors a bill fighting abortion, and then
-- cheating on his wife and family, asked his extra martial affair girl
friend to have an ABORTION.
What do Hugh Hefner, Bill Clinton, Weinstein, Cosby, and Trump have that the
creepy, dirty old men, that society shuns, don't have? Money & power -
all other things are equal. With money and power, you can not only sustain your
objectification of women for a long time while people look away, you're
actually celebrated for it...provided you donate lots of money to the
"right" causes and say the right things in public. Look no further than
Hefner's deification upon death, and now Weinstein is being defended by
none other than so-called women's advocate, Lisa Bloom, who flipped her
position on women the second wads of cash passed under her nose.
@ scrappy doo: While your statement is factually true on its face, it ignores a
couple of important facts that have contributed to higher numbers:1)
The definition of rape has changed since the 1960’s - marital rape,
male-male rape, and female-male rape are now included; additionally rape no
longer requires an explicit “no” - if the victim is unconscious or
otherwise incapacitated, or does not feel safe saying “no”, those
situations are now counted as rapes. 2) The social stigma of being a
victim of rape has decreased. This makes victims, especially male victims, more
likely to come forward. Both of these are direct results of the
sexual revolution and both of them add to increased reporting of rape. Neither
of them mean rape is more prevalent.
"Hollywood, Hefner and hypocrisy"Bam!! What a slam
dunk correct line.
Karen is correct. The sexual revolution is an empowerment of women, allowing
more exposure of those that would seek to oppress and abuse them. Those that
seek to objectify them today would have had an easier time in the past because
they would not risk their credibility. Also, no mention of the
'access Hollywood' tape. I would recommend everyone review it in
its' uncensored form, and consider how we treat those that objectify women.
DN editorsYou don't have to be a "Conservative" to
believe that marriage between two committed individuals is a good thing. I
think that science has proved that humans seek a stable partnership with another
person. Oh, and BTW, this includes our LGBT brothers and sisters.However, to assert as you do that the sexual revolution is responsible for the
likes of Mr Weinstein and his ilk (could also include the President) for
harassing women in the workplace is a stretch. And you should know that.Women were chattel and the possession of men long before the
Enlightenment in Europe. In fact, today in some cultures women are still seen
as mere adornments in patriarchal societies. It comes as no surprise to me that
men still believe they may abuse women verbally, physically and sexually with or
without sexual revolution.Marriage of equals = Good thing. Men
demeaning women in relationships work, societal, religious and marital =
Continued oppression. And this continued oppression bodes ill for good
Part of having rights is the obligation to accept the consequences. The examples you have provided are examples of people refusing to accept the
consequences or blatantly violating others right of self-determination by using
coercion. It has nothing to do with marriage or the lack thereof.
This guy is just the golden tip of the liberal hypocrite spear... I actually saw
a glowing obit on Hefner written by a female member of congress who is of course
a Democrat... You would have thought that Hefner, the man who lead the way in
objectifying women, glamorizing pornography and the degradation of women should
be up for sainthood.... Have you ever seen the historical crime rates for
rape... The stats show an amazing increase since 1960 that continues unabated
even though murders and property crimes which rocketed up thru the 1970's
thru the 1990's have dropped off a bit. It's as if the Dems and
liberals opened a Pandora's box on the poor treatment of women ... Our
forefathers would be rightfully appalled
Another thought in response to this baseless argument:Nothing about
female emancipation said, "Okay, guys. You no longer have to be responsible
for your behavior." What a complete cop out.The reality is that
the increasing empowerment of women is precisely why the Weinstein's and
the Tim Murphy's and the Bill O'Reilly's and the Bill
Cosby's and the Roger Ailes' of this world are increasingly being
exposed. Men are finally, finally being held accountable. Way to go, ladies!
Full steam ahead!
hypocrisy is an understatement. unfortunately this type of behavior is
considered normal to libs.
Right. Hypocrisy and sexual predation by males in positions of power
weren't a problem until the "sexual revolution."