Having been a Cougar fan for over 65 years, I'm disgusted by the lack of
performance this year. While I am not ready to call for the coaches jobs yet,
something is definitely wrong with the program. The performance keeps getting
worse ( 8 first downs today??? vs. Mississippi State's 35???). And DEAD
LAST in the nation in scoring YTD. Can it survive after this years
horrible performance, I think it has set it back at least 30 years. Questions
the A.D. and the administration must answer are1. Why would ANY power 5
conference even consider including this program after this year?2. What
will it do to recruiting? Why would a blue-chip player (in-state or outside the
state) sign with the Cougars?3. Why would ESPN continue to sign contracts
to broadcast games of a losing program?4. What will it do to attendance
at the LaVell Edwards stadium if this is allowed to continue?Mangum
is NOT the only problem, if at all. Look at his performance as a freshman. He
also had a full year to be on the sideline last year to learn the offence. Before you send me hateful comments, prove one thing I've said is wrong.
Yes, I'm hoping, but certainly not confident of the future.
I don't know how one can write "most schools are on the brink of
collapse" and "most conferences are on the brink of collapse." Such is not the state of higher education in the US or Utah. Conferences
are sustainable, it is independence that is not.
I was shocked to find this story...surely with a Heisman winning quarterback who
taught many NFL quarterbacks all they know that the transition to being a
phenomenal OC was just a small step. I guess not.Either Detmer is
in way over his head or the talent on the team is so woefully poor that even he,
the one who taught Bret Farve all he knows, can't make the Cougars into
something they will never be.
This year I have seen some of the worst play calling ever from Ty. 3rd and 1 to
the smallest running back on the team several times and 3rd and 1 bombs. But
the team's troubles are far from being just Ty's fault and his big
learning curve. I would say the OL coach has had just as much or more trouble.
He also seems to be in a big time learning curve. Imagine 4 returning starters
and such horrendous play (give the touted freshman tackle a chance). But most
of all the QB play- poor decision making and throws has destroyed the offense.
A real lack of ability and knack to get a first down. The DL has been pushed
around much more than I expected. They are obviously missing their outside LB,
who was not able to play this year. Most of all on the defense the safeties
look bad. Several of the safeties have been burned for TDs including #23
Anderson several times. Not sure why he is getting so much PT when they have
able safeties that can step in. A real team and coaching effort. Really
disappointed but will hang in there with the team.
Ty Detmer has always been a stand up guy both as a player and a coach. Ty has
plaid the game at a level few players ever do and I’m sure he will be just
as legendary as a Coach. Football is a violent sport and injuries have taken a
brutal toll on BYU’s skill positions this year. No coach or staff can
control that. Us arm chair coaches need to chill a bit and try and appreciate
the challenges BYU coaches are facing and just.......wish them well.
One thing for sure ----- if they BYU needs new coaches, they only need to look
in the DN comment section on what to do.It is filled with many qualified
candidates who know exactly what has to be done and how to do it
@Sportsfan123Watch the games Tolutau is not in shape!! He keeps
tapping out. He isn’t and will never be full game running back.
@65TossPowerTrap - Salmon, ID"BYU needs to tweak its offense to
be more like Stanford. A physical offense that relies heavily on running. I know
that makes the old-school BYU fans lurch, but it's not 1984 anymore. BYU
simply cannot recruit the speed to run an effective spread offense. I love the
smash-mouth offense that Stanford runs. BYU can recruit that type of
player."------To play "smash-mouth" football you need
"smash-mouth" coaches like Shaw and Whittingham. With the programs those
two are running it will be very hard for the Y to recruit. BYU is already
losing out to Utah, Stanford and USC when it comes to Utah talent.
A lot of people really find pleasure in kicking a guy when he's down.It takes a few years to get your guys in place and your system going.I think BYU could still hit a bowl game, and I think 2018 will be some
improvement but not everything, I think 2019 will be when we see why Ty Detmer
was hired.Be patient, we wanted a whole new system, this is what it
generally takes to get there.
Perhaps next time they will hire someone who has the right stuff to get the job
done instead of hiring someone just because he's nice and smiles a lot. As
Cat Stevens put it in his song Wild World: "Oh baby baby it's a wild
world; It's hard to get by just upon a smile ."
I don't believe recruiting on offense has much to do with the type of
offense you run except at the quarterback position. I offer the
following.1. BYU offense has talent2. Running backs are OK.
3. Different set plays in the game are OK. 4. Choice/timing of
plays in games is pathetic.5. Start passing to your tight ends most of the
time on pass plays. Everyone sees it, but coaches/quarterbacks at BYU refuse to
listen.We need to concentrate on getting first downs instead of
touchdowns. First downs take care of touchdowns eventually. Examples: 1. Long bomb with 4th and 1. It is about a 10% likelihood
of succeeding. Long bombs are best done on 1st down. You can still get the
first down with remaining plays.2. 2nd down and 3 yards to go. We
start going for long passes instead of running it and getting the first down or
doing a short pass(to a tight end). We ignore the need to get the
first down until it is 3rd and long. Detmer needs to concentrate
on higher percentage options to getting the first down. Risky is not better.
The element of surprise is overrated.Being risky eventually risks
You have to at least respect his honesty. He just needs adjust what he is trying
to do to the players he has. Give them some time. The fans reaction to to this
years start has me almost embarrassed , come on ,you can't always have what
Where do we go from here? Intramural flag football.
eastcoastcoug - What form does "support" take, long-term? I
haven't read anyone calling Sitake or Detmer jerks or losers. They are
well-liked by pretty much everyone, including opponents. That's great . .
as long as you're competent on the field. I don't insist a successful
coach has to intentionally rankle people like Jim Harbaugh, but being a good
dude only buys you so much goodwill. I don't want either of
these two to lose a job, and I will be more than happy to see the team rebound
next year with them calling the shots. This season is a total bust, and I can
live with that. But if we get another season remotely like this in 2018, it
would be hard to make a case not to blow things up. If gaining
Those of you who think all we need to do is give Detmer more time, well, not to
sound like a nelly nay sayer, but you dont take a team like this that has the
talent and depth to be competitive go 9-4 the previous year and then just go
1-13 the following year. Cuz lets face it, they struggled to score against a FCS
opponent in Portland state and cant score against any other team thus far, they
average 10pts a game which effectively makes them the worst offense in the
country.If you ask why this is happening? Well look no further than
basic fundamentals, and no emphasis on execusion. The recievers run
poor routes - coach Cahoon. The runningbacks are ineffective and fumble prone-
coach Mahe. The offense does not rely heavy on their best players, why has
Tolutau not played a full game yet, why is Matt Bushman not catching 5 to 8
passes a game? Furthermore the offense doesnt continue to run their effective
schemes or plays continually until the oponent stops it , doing this will set up
other plays which makes the whole playbook work - coach Detmer.The
most basics of football arent being taught, and if they dont understand this
they never will. Detmer, Cahoon, Mahe need to go.
I find it interesting that several have talked about recruits switching from the
U to the Y. Have you been reading the paper's lately. Seems it is the
other way a round. And as for educational experience, the University of Utah
has a great educational experience regardless of personal believes.
As critical and honest as I've been about BYU, I think we fans need to show
some class and support these coaches. They're both great men and I love
Sitake's philosophy in developing these players. I was at the
Miami game in '90 and rushed the field after the game. He will always be a
champion. Remember that, and consider how it would look if BYU fans ran their
only Heisman winner out of town. Imagine that news story on ESPN. We
don't pay our coaches well (assistants even less), and these 2 men are as
good as we'll get. Time to show some class and support our team and
He admits there have been problems? How honest! That's like admitting your
house is on fire as the last wall collapses and the fire department is wrapping
things up. I love me some Ty Detmer, but it's hard for me to believe the
players are so ill-suited to his "pro-style" scheme that they should be
THIS bad. I mean, you're 127th out of 129 FBS schools in total offense. Read that again . . that's not just bad; that's a catastrophe.
I honestly don't know where you go from here. What's the best we can
hope for; a top-80 offense in a couple of years if we get some breaks? Can
anyone cite me an example of a coaching staff taking a team from decent (year
one) to putrid (year two) to nationally competitive?Honest question;
what does anyone see here that would make you optimistic other than wishful
After more than 1 1/2 years, he is still trying to learn what the players do
best? That is a sad commentary. That should have been long ago.
65 traps: “I agree with Detmer - he doesn't know modern college
football offensive schemes. I also respect him for admitting it.”If he doesn’t know modern college football, then he’s at the right
place that still lives in the 1980’s.
When LaVell took over, expectations were different and the program wasn't
on the slippery slope that it's on today.
LaVell Edwards was head coach of BYU football for 27 years, and his ONLY season
where he had more conference losses than wins was his SECOND year. Looks like our new coaching staff is experiencing similar growing pains.
Everything will be okay. I just feel badly for Fred Warner.
BYU needs to tweak its offense to be more like Stanford. A physical offense
that relies heavily on running. I know that makes the old-school BYU fans
lurch, but it's not 1984 anymore. BYU simply cannot recruit the speed to
run an effective spread offense. I love the smash-mouth offense that Stanford
runs. BYU can recruit that type of player.
"where they are headed in the future"?2 options- Immediately
pony up a ton of money for some good coaches or...start working on an exit plan
for the program.
Um, what learning curve? I haven't seen any evidence that anything has been
learned this season.
A very candid interview. It begs the question of where they are headed in the
future. Are they going back to the spread offense?
Change is wonderful!!!
I agree with Detmer - he doesn't know modern college football offensive
schemes. I also respect him for admitting it.
re: BlueHusky "...So, BYU fans, don't expect a fast
conversion to a pro-set...."Pro-set, really? I
can't tell whether they are trying to run a zone-read, Woody Hayes
smash-mouth, or Lavell era WCO? For now, its resembles a really poor chimera of
all 3. That said, a hybrid of The Redskins (Joe Gibbs' 1st
tenure) & Bill Walsh style WCO might be the best way for byu to go.
As a Utah fan, I hope BYU fans all keep having patience with him and wait for
him to gain his footing and recruits.In the meantime, Utah will be
winning one after another after another...
@ Holy-Schamoly-What Baloney - Kaysville, UTWith all due
respect...neither Kalani nor Ty could shine Lavell Edwards shoes...
Knowing the coaches a little.. I will stick with em til the end. This year,
and possibly next year will lay an amazing foundation, and after that, things
will be much improved and they can become dangerous..
In short, I’m not afraid to say I’mOver my head.
"Utah may lose out and their recruits will switch to the Y for a better
education experience and future."christopher robin:You managed to go 0-for-four in just one sentence. That's got to be a
You guys know nothing about coaching. Neither do I. But nobody fires a coach in
their 2nd year with half their recruits out on missions, and still using guys
recruited for a spread. It will take another two or three years to build their
system with their players.That is the major issue with BYU's
mission program relative to sports programs. It is very disruptive. Look at the
hoops program. Different team every year. Coming and going. No continuity. The
fools that think having half your recruits go on a mission is an advantage is
naive.So, BYU fans, don't expect a fast conversion to a
pro-set. Guys coming back now were recruited three years ago. They were
recruited for spread.
The learning curve is a lot tougher when it's clear that you have no
business coaching a college team.Pop Warner? Sure.High school?
Fine.College? He's out of his depth here.
Memo to coaches Detmer & Sitake: it's not that hard to figure out what
scheme to use. You now work for the BYU football program. So throw the ball.
To your backs & tight ends in particular. Mix in short 4-5 yard slant
passes. A lot. Ensure at least 75% of your plays are pass plays. And then try
to have a linebacker-centered defense that's decent enough to still win
games. People will accept it as long as it's good enough to keep opponents
under 35 points per game.
BYU brought in an entirely new coaching staff. That means new plays, new
methods of teaching, new bonding between coaches AND players, different
expectations of performance. I am glad that the coaches are talking together
about what works and doesn't work. Here is a thought: why not develop a
dual QB system, with both QB's on the field at the same time (like guards
in the NBA). QB1 takes the snap and can run, hand off, pitch out, or lateral to
QB2, who is already deep and in position to pass without needing to drop back
and then get set? Just a thought, otherwise, I am not ready to give on on this
team (although I am disappointed at this point). They actually have improved,
but ball security is an issue.
Patience....quick, right now, give me PATIENCE!!!Take whatever time
is required, coaches, you'll come out of it with flying colors. Remember a
guy named Lavell?
Ty is a nice guyHis players cannot be confident with him as weekly
he feeds them to the lions.When MJ became coach of the Bobcats in
NBA they quickly became bottom dwellers, even though their coach knew the game,
knew all the intricacies and how to beat every other player in the league it was
something he knew but couldn't coach.Reality check shows BYU
has far from the worst offensive players in the league but that is where their
offense stands.Does anyone think Urban Meyer would be walking around
scratching his head and muttering things like t will take time to work it out.
He took Utah and put those mediocre players on the ncaa map.I like
Ty but the sooner this experiment is over the better off the program will be.It is an excuse if someone says Ty did not choose these players. The
qbs that BYU attracts have always been top class and this season is no
different, the talent is there but without sharp, firm and correct direction
they will flounder.Nice that coach Sitake said the floundering
offense was on him, but that is a pr stunt. He has to be sick as the head coach
who has turned the offense over to a friend and now he sees the program
Yes, this is not a tiny little high school in Texas.
. . . But, do not look just at how you can change the Xs and Os. Consider how
you can inspire the players better. I would be guessing this is more the problem
than the Xs and Os.
This is a welcome article. With it being no doubt that the offense is
struggling, if he had the attitude that his players just weren't listening,
or if he were being bullheaded about how they were doing the right thing, and
just need to persevere, that would be a concern. But, if he is looking to
change, looking to learn, then he can get better.
We are behind you coach. I will gladly take a couple of years of growing pains
to have some solid, stand up coaches that will stick around for a long time.LaVell had some growing pains at the start too. Don't
listen to the millennial fans that think they have to have it all right now. We
are in this for the long haul.Stick with it, improve each game,
learn and study, and know we want you here for a long time.
Bleeding blue-They are not “their” recruits. Ty did not
recruit the current qb’s or offensive line. This is going to
take a few years. More than usual due to missions. I am confident Kalani and
Ty with figure it all out. However, they may need to make a few personnel
Keep learning, keep working. We're laying the foundation. It's
painful, but it will pay off.
Detmer and Sitake are not the problem. Their players are average to below
average division 1 football athletes. And they have a drastic void of high
skill players. Taysom Hill and Jamaal Williams camouflaged this disparity last
year in a big way, both of which are NFL talents.Byu just isn't
a power 5 team and will take beatings annually until they enter their cupcake
portion of their schedule.
If we win as much as Harvard, Princeton and Yale, it will be okay, as long as we
win at life. Most universities are on brink of collapse, so the Y is winner in
all areas of most important. Most conferences are on brink of collapse.
Utah may lose out and their recruits will switch to the Y for a better education
experience and future. Let's all be fans if we win 5 to 6 games a year,
it is a fun game and it is a game.
Ty, you've been in football your whole life. I'm pulling for you.
I'm glad you are trying new wrinkles. Lavelle figured out he had to throw
a lot because he didn't have the speed. Just figure something out. An
average offense would be a huge improvement.I do like that the TE is
back this year. That is the one play that seems to have a chance. The safety
dump to the RB worked well last week. Toledo's offense last
year gave BYU fits. I mean they can't recruit that well can they? How
about some stealing of plays and schemes.
I have no doubt Ty Detmer is a really good guy. He is a legend at BYU from his
QB days. I’m sure he has a solid understanding of pro style offenses.
But....it isn’t encouraging to hear that our OC is learning things
relative to his job “on the fly”. Hopefully he’s a quick
Coach Detmer has to get off the field and into the booth where he can see live
what is happening or better, what is not happening. Seeing it live rather than
on film day after the game. He cannot make adjustments on what he does not know
what is going on.
Doesnt that simply mean that BYU is still does not know what kind of system to
run with their type of recruits? No wonder recruits are starting to not want
to go there.