@DavidWhy is it not ok for Bannon to "try to control the
political power" in this country while it does appear that it is ok for
people like George Soros to try to do the exact same thing?Some of
us are confused about this concept.
Obviously, Steve Bannon doesn't know everything. He demonstrated extreme
ignorance in this instance.God bless America. Happy to see we are
making America great again!😁
Ironic given Mr. Romney was nearly commander in chief, and would have been
expert at funding at army, navy and air force. And yes, Mr. Romney was the
better choice in 2008, than John McCain again that one knows how to fund things
and oversee payroll, whereas the other does not. (Mr. McCain lost 100 million
dollars in the 2008 primaries and his campaign went broke). All thru the
1950's, especially during the Korean war, one was drafted and that took
precedence over missions, and in the early 1950's, there were very very few
missionaries. Let us compare Bannon's many marriages with his trying to
appeal to evangelicals. Irony all around. Mr. Romney is not perfect, and yet
people try so hard to find flaws in a one marriage man.
@nonamesacceptedRepublicans put activist judges on the bench.
Don’t pretend republicans are some how constitutional purists.
You can't go after Steve Bannon about his Mormon comments, whilst
cheering him and Trump for saying the same sorts of things about Muslims....Donald Trump and Steve Bannon and Roy Moore SHOULD be the wake up call
to Republican Mormons...Time to take a stand....
Roy Moore, 70, is facing multiple allegations of sexual misconduct, including
accusations that he molested two teenage girls and pursued romantic
relationships with several others while in his 30s. Mitt went on a
mission and went to work.Tell me again why the alt-right hate Mitt?
Bannon and his ilk are trying to control the political power in the US. They
represent a disgusting, bigotted, amoral, violent brand that must be rejected in
the next election. Generally, Utahns should vote opposite of anyone
Bannon and Trump support. This means Hatch. Orin has been in the Senate for 42
years. It is time for him to give up his seat. Additionally, I am very
concerned with the alignment Hatch has with Trump, and I am concerned with
Bannon's support of Hatch.Anyone Bannon supports should be
voted against. This is the only way voters can send a message that we do not
want the sleezy, abusive, biggotted version of politics that Bannon and Trump
Adapting Martin NiemÖller to 2017:===First he targeted
the Mexicans, and I did not speak out—Because I was not a
Mexican.Then he targeted the Muslims, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Muslims.Then he targeted the African
Americans, and I did not speak out— Because I was not an African
American.Then he targeted the Mormons...===How do
folks want this story to end this time?
Romney didn't hide behind the mission to avoid going to Vietnam. He still
would have gone on the mission even if there was no war. He didn't do it
to avoid the war. And he hadn't been drafted and there is a chance he
wouldn't have ever been drafted. So, should he have put off everything to
wait to see if he was drafted. That would mean that no one in the country
should have been going to college so they wouldn't have their deferments.
Going on a mission isn't hiding from service. My dad served a mission
and then still got drafted and served 11 months in Vietnam.
Bannon is a man with such a "moral" compass that we should listen to
Another thing that is not mentioned about Judge Moore's case is
Alabama's legal age of consent is 16. Alabama needs to change that. Even if
true most of the allegations against Moore would have been legal. I live in
Mississippi ,alot of kids run to Alabama to get married, that would be under age
One point that is missing from all of these comments is the lottery.
Evidently, most people who have commented are too young to remember it.I am three weeks younger than Mitt, and I was in the second lottery. Each
year, birthdays were selected and sequenced. My birthday, April 3, was 83rd.
Guys whose birthdays were within the first 150 or so were targeted for the
draft. So, we need to know where Mitt's birthday fell on the list; if it
was above the cutoff, then he would not have been drafted.The fact
that Mitt was on a mission did not get him out of the draft, it just delayed it.
Graduate school may have also gotten him a deferment; I do not remember the
rules. I had a student deferment while I was going to college as an
undergraduate; but when I graduated in 1969 , my draft status changed.
@joe5 Where are you getting your information?"what
appears to be a forged yearbook"?"lies that are not supported in
court documents nor the timeline of when the accusers claim they occurred"
et al...Are they lies because Roy Moore says they are? "Moore's situation is different than Conyers, Franken, Weinstein,
Spacey, Lauer, and all the others who have also been recently accused. In each
of those cases, there is a smoking gun (or several) that leaves no doubt about
their guilt."In each of the cases you mention (with the
exception of Franken, whose photos could easily be construed to be humorous and
not nefarious and who actually has an accuser with a political axe to grind) the
evidence is the testimony of the victims. Exactly the same standard of evidence
being used to judge Mr. Moore.Also, I was around 40 years ago. It
was NOT common practice for 30 year old men to date 15 year old girls.
"Romney 'hid' behind religion in not enlisting?"Well . . . Is Bannon right?Did Romney hide behind his religion to
avoid military service?Gary Herbert rails against Bannon, but he
doesn't really deny that assertion, does he?And neither do the
Bannon enjoys the same rights to free speech as do the writers of the Book of
Mormon Musical. That both choose to use their freedoms in offensive ways to
demean others is an unfortunate cost of freedom. Fortunately, Bannon isn't
running for office.Many of those jumping to condemn Bannon and try
to rile up LDS against him and any politician he supports are among the
staunchest defenders and patrons of material that mocks and attacks Mormons
including the aforementioned musical, Saturday's Voyeur, etc. These people
dislike LDS and Romney every bit as much or more than does Bannon. Bannon plays
to an anti-LDS southern audience. Many in Utah who attack Bannon are very
anti-LDS themselves. I don't intend to let either group goad me into
anything for their own political purposes.Had those who now feign
defense of Romney actually voted for him, and had the religious right that so
disliked Obama voted for Romney, we would never have had Trump or Bannon in
political power. We would have also been spared a 2nd Obama term.So
all sides should spare us the attempts to politicize how anyone feels about LDS.
@Open Minded Mormon: "You are either a Donald Trump, Steve Bannon, Roy
Moore, and Orrin Hatch Republican or You are Mitt Romney, Jeff Flake
Republican."False dichotomy that many of us reject. Simpletons
see the world in black and white."Sitting in my LDS High Priest
Group..."Why is it that the liberals who scream the loudest
about mixing of politics and religion, and claiming that conservatives unjustly
make liberals feel like they don't belong in church, so often turn around
and are the most overt about wearing their religion on their sleeves and
claiming it is the conservative members of the congregation who are getting
sideways with the Lord or with gospel principles?Hypocrisy is a
strong word, but I can find none other to describe what I see here.Trump came in 3rd in the 2-way Utah GOP primary. Very few of us like Trump
personally. But you Democrats nominated the one person whose personality and
policies were both far worse.A lot of us do like some of
Trump's key policies including Gorsuch and other originalists on the
courts, recognizing Jerusalem as the capital of Israel, and working to enforce
immigration law. Ds should give me a better option next time.
Like many Mormons at the time including myself, Romney should have served in the
military and completed a mission too. A lot of us did. In fact, during the
Vietnam War the Church put a cap on the number of missionaries called except
those who completed or were doing military service. So Mitt did hide behind the
Church to avoid military service. And his five sons? No military service?
The fact is, the next Senator from Alabama will either be a pro-abortion
Democrat who supports socialized medicine and will demand activist judges on the
federal courts, or a political and social conservative who will support
originalists on the court, but who has some very disturbing allegations of
sexual assault against him.Those are the choices folks.The Democrats demand pro-abortion, want government controlled medical care,
delight in judicial activism, and will be voting for the Democrat.The Republicans oppose sexual assault, but do not yet have enough credible
information to know whether the allegations are true. There are enough
contradictions and obvious political motivations in both the allegations
themselves and in the timing of their release as to raise very reasonable doubts
in most honest people's minds.Were I a voter in Alabama,
I'd vote for Moore (or at least against the Democrat) and then let
investigations play out. If they fizzle, my vote is vindicated. If they become
more credible, I can demand Moore's resignation, or even expulsion or
prosecution. At very least I vote differently in the GOP primary in 6 years.
But no partisan advantage to the left.
@joe5;"Impartial: Do you even know what those two incidents were
about?" "He fought what was, to some of us, a huge over-reach of
the federal judiciary (Obama appointees trying to remove the historical legacy
of not only the United States itself but the foundation of our legal system).
" Joe, I have a total understanding of the incidents. Do you
understand the timeline? Moore's issue with the 10 commandments happened
in 2003. That was George Bush Jr. Obama wasn't President until 2008. Those
were GOP Bush appointees. He also had a similar issue in 1990 when George H.W.
Bush was President.
last post - I'll give it to byufottoballrocksMitt Romney should
know better. In 2012, who can forget Harry Reid's admission that he had
lied and justification that "He didn't get elected, did he?" He led
the campaign of falsely accusing Romney and, at least in his own mind, it played
a role in keeping Romney from the oval office.While this discussion
is about Bannon (who has never had to retract anything for being false), we
should remember that lying is standard procedure for Democrats.Clinton: "I never had sex with that woman."Obama: "You
will still be able to choose your own doctor."Clinton:
"There was nothing classified in my personal emails."The
list is literally endless. And yet there is a contingent in our nation that
continues to lap up every word as if it was gospel. Personally, I don't get
it. When you've been misled and deliberately deceived hundreds of times,
isn't there some point when you start to have a doubt or two?I
like Romney and voted for him twice. But I won't do that again. A man who
jumps on flimsy accusations for political expediency is no more moral than the
next politician. Nothing distinguishes him from the crowd any more.
@RedSmith et al,Bannon has a point which is completely off topic.
Let's find something despicable in those who show moral courage in
questioning a known Child Molester and hit that. HARD.So, go ahead
and play the 'What about' game and side with those who put Party over
Principle. Side with those who attack OUR Mormon DNA and beliefs. Who think
Missionary Service isn't anything special (we're part of a cult after
all). I just can't believe we're even having this
This whole Roy Moore thing is an enigma. His reported indiscretions occurred
like 40 years ago. Since that time he apparently has live a very conservative
and religious life style. His wife appears to stand by him completely.Not sure what to make of all this but those who allege stuff happened 40 years
ago raise some questions as to why they are just now bringing this so
publically?Let the voters in Alabama decide - I will defer to their
Fabled: Bad example. Two completely different eras. Not comparable.Anti-Trump:If Obama had the economic indicators that Trump has, he
would be nominated for a Nobel Prize in economics.Bannon's
media outlet is never forced to retract anything they print (nobody can disprove
it) while just about every liberal media outlet routinely has to retract and
print corrections. Frankly, I prefer that track record of truth-telling.Nobody has proven anything against Moore despite using forged yearbooks,
accusers who have a history of fraud and whose stories have unraveled under
scrutiny. Twice suspended from the bench for supporting the 10 commandments and
traditional marriage (sounds pretty Mormon to me).Your joke about
not being able to be Mormon and Republican at the same time is truly laughable.
It is far more accurate to say you cannot be Mormon and Democrat at the same
time when you consider abortion, same-sex marriage, religious freedom, the dole,
the hugely disproportionate victimization of women, corruption in the DNC,
Clinton campaign, and Mueller investigation, and the removal of God from their
This is the new party before country GOP and it reeks. Willing to elect a guy
who was twice removed from being a judge because he refused to follow the
constitution. A guy who was known to 'court' teenagers while in his
30s, a fact he doesnt even dispute. But hey, tax cuts for
billionaires, right? That is sure to fix everything and those manufacturing jobs
that CEOs moved to China because people will work for a couple bucks a day are
going to come streaming back any day now...any day now...MAGA! Once all the wealth in the country is concentrated into just a few
families we will finally be 'great again'. I mean it worked in the
1920s, right? What could go wrong?
@Red Smith"The Alabama choice is - Does one support a Democrat and
abortion or support a Republican with 40 year old harassment cloud?"Put another way, does one support a Democrat whose family has never had an
abortion and believes this is a personal decision, not the governments. Or does
one support a man who has multiple accusers, supported with collaborating
testimony, saying he preyed and groped underage girls. A man who has been
removed from office, twice, for violating his office and the constitution of the
This is the great sifting....You are either a Donald Trump, Steve
Bannon, Roy Moore, and Orrin Hatch Republican -- or You are Mitt
Romney, Jeff Flake Republican.Sitting in my LDS High Priest Group,
I see the sifting, I can clearly see who is putting their Party
ahead of their Principles....and Sen. Jeff Flake's check to
Doug Jones yesterday nailed it.
Steve Bannion should not have brought Mitt Romney's religion into this.And Romney is wrong in condemning Judge Moore through Twitter without
the benefit of real facts. Romney doesn't know squat, other
than that accusations have been brought forward, and it's despicable for
him to imply that those who doubt the allegations are somehow lacking in
integrity or common sense or are putting politics first. It's now been
revealed through the press that many of the Moore accusations are full of holes.
That's partly why Judge Moore is back in the lead in the polls,
as Alabamians don't like the Washington Post and media and political elites
telling them who and what they should believe. Mitt Romney has said
it's a different set of rules if you're running. Unlike a court, if
you are accused you're done. Under Romney's logic, what's going
to happen in the future when false allegations are brought forward, as happened
in the sad case of a Maryland High School teacher a few years ago? The person
gets destroyed and only later is it revealed that they were innocent. That's why Bannion got so upset. But again it was wrong in my view for
him to attack the Romney family or his faith.
Bannon is correct. Romney could have chosen to serve in the military rather than
serve a mission. A number of LDS general authorities did so including President
Donald Trump, Steve Bannon and Roy Moore ARE the Republican Party!Republicans need to step up and OWN them for who they are!They are
YOURS, not mine!I'll have nothing to do with this evil
'new' Republican Party!Mormon Republicans are now caught
in quite the dilemma.You are either a Mormon or a Republican.but
your moral compass can't let you be both any longer.
Wow,How does a member of the LDS church which I am, support the
party who continues to belittle the religion I choose to belong to while
claiming that Christians are under assault but choose not to stand up for my
Christian religion. Interesting that two members stand up for what they believe
to be right and are under attack from Mr. Bannon ie. Trump's attack dog and
the new voice of the Republican party. Interesting that our Utah contingent,
all of them members of the LDS Church cower in the corner waiting for Mr. Trump
to tell them what to do next. I didn't vote for Mitt Romney
but if he continues to show a willingness to take principled stands I would
certainly vote for him over Mr. Trump's best friend Orrin Hatch. I also
respect Mr. Flake for standing up on the senate floor and taking a stand again,
while the good legislators from our great state sit nervously waiting to be told
what to do next.
Impartial: Do you even know what those two incidents were about?One
was because he refused to remove a ten commandments monument from the lobby of
the Alabama Judicial Building. He fought what was, to some of us, a huge
over-reach of the federal judiciary (Obama appointees trying to remove the
historical legacy of not only the United States itself but the foundation of our
legal system). Many would be pleased that someone had the courage to risk
everything, including his own career, to fight against the secularism that is
invading our nation. Instead of being maligned, many would regard his actions as
heroic.The other was because he continued to enforce the
state's ban on same-sex marriage despite the fact that the ban was declared
unconstitutional. Again, many would view this as heroic.In short,
his suspensions were matter of conscience, not matters of capability or judicial
malfeasance.I find it ironic that you, along with others who
routinely air these suspensions, do not provide the full context so people can
decide if he is hero or villain. In many way, his actions could be viewed as
similar to our founding fathers.
@Light and Liberty "Obama coyly sucked most of the Democrats and a host of
Republicans into a full vamp of Socialism (No Democrat wants to admit the evils
of Socialism. ..."I am a socialist. I belong to the Socialist
Party - USA. So I guess you think I am a tool of Satan. I deny this. First, Democrats are not socialists. They have done some great things
but they are the #2 capitalist party.Second, socialism and
capitalism are a binary pair. One is always an alternative of the other. This
has been the story the last 300 years. Socialism is not
"evil" But it has its problems, as does capitalism. In fact socialism
often works very well. There are today no purely capitalist or purely socialist
countries. There has been a confluence of systems as predicted ably by the late
economist John Kenneth Galbraith.One thing is critical, there needs
to be an appreciation for Karl Marx in economics. Both socialists and
capitalists need to know him even if he does not change their minds.Of course I am wasting my breath here.
@joe5;" I have yet to see a smoking gun for Moore"How
about the fact the he was removed from the bench-twice, for breaking the law?
I wouldn't hold draft avoidance against Romney... but him doing so while he
supported the war is hypocritical.
If you want to talk about "honor" and "integrity" does not Mr
Bannon get PAID to say the things he says? There is also a concept of selling
your soul for filthy lucre that he does not bring up....and one might also place
what position in the Trump empire is Mr Bannon gunning for as well...
Yeah - Steve Bannon is quite the war hero.
This is one independent that knew Bannon was out for blood. I also would have
voted for Trump over Romney. I also believe Romney has more character than
Trump. Obama coyly sucked most of the Democrats and a host of Republicans into
a full vamp of Socialism (No Democrat wants to admit the evils of Socialism. I
am not sure they think evil exists, except when someone mentions the Bill of
Rights, the Constitution, or work ethic). So, here we are. The Republican
party does not represent me, never has, nor ever will. The last Republican I
wholeheartedly voted for was Ronald Reagan, the greatest president of the 20th
century. John F. Kennedy, a moral reprobate, actually was the best Democratic
president of the 20th century. Both, ironically, didn't espouse the party
line on many issues. Which means, there is an American center that actually
believes in liberty, listens intently for those who believe in liberty, and will
even vote for the lesser of two evils to steer the ship of state away from the
two political parties destroying America. The center will hold to fight
Socialism (Democrats) and Fascism (Republican), against the tide of Bannon or
I tire of the moral superiority of those who claim their military service makes
them better than another. I know many who have served, and I respect their
sacrifice, but I know a lot of people who go into the military because it's
a steady job, not because they have more dedication to their country than the
guy who didn't enlist.
I can't think of any group or population with more "honor and
integrity" than LDS missionaries!
Steve Bannon went to war.Mit and his 5 sons did not.Steve Bannon has a point.It's one thing to talk about things
and another thing to put your life on the line.However, claiming
moral superiority is no excuse to trash folks.The Alabama choice is
- Does one support a Democrat and abortion or support a Republican with 40 year
old harassment cloud?There are no good choices, only a better
Sorry, Mr. Bannon didn't say that about Bill Clinton and Muhammad Ali (
The forefathers of this country sought to create a "marketplace of
ideas" where truth would win out after civil dialogue. We are about as far
from that great ideal as possible. We have Bannon, Trump and others who rant,
name call and slander. What are we becoming?I used to lean to the
right more often than not politically. The last election is the first time I
didn't vote for either major party as I could not do so in good conscience.
I fear it will not be the last time the choices in an election are: Bad and
Worse.Time to study the founding fathers of this nation and get back
to what truly made America great.
I didn't hear that from Moore about Bill Clinton or Muhammad Ali (Cassius
To all Mormons, the Trump wing of the GOP does not like you. They will pull
anything out of the air to attack people if they feel like it. Trump hid behind
fake bone spurs that miraculously healed whenever it was convenient. Hatch
didn't serve, but tries to claim his service by feeling bad about the death
of his brother in WWII. If Romney didn't serve in the military, yet speaks
out against people like Trump and Roy Moore, while Hatch, Trump and Bannon
support people unsuited for high office, I'll take Romney every time.
Romney at least shows a moral backbone.
The #1 cited opposition to Moore is the accusations against him. Accusations
that include what appears to be a forged yearbook, lies that are not supported
in court documents nor the timeline of when the accusers claim they occurred,
lies from a cop who admitted she was basing everything on her dislike for Moore,
lies that were refuted by a mall owner and other eyewitnesses to the account,
lies that were refuted by the accusers' own family members, and some
behaviors that appear weird in 2017 but were culturally common 40 years ago.I have a hard time understanding why people keep believing these are
credible accounts?Or does this really come just come down to nothing
more than not liking his politics so people are anxious to try to ruin his life
just to keep him out of office. Where is the morality in that? Where is the
honor?Moore's situation is different than Conyers, Franken,
Weinstein, Spacey, Lauer, and all the others who have also been recently
accused. In each of those cases, there is a smoking gun (or several) that leaves
no doubt about their guilt. I have yet to see a smoking gun for Moore.
" , , , , He noted that Moore graduated from the United States Military
Academy, while Romney received a draft deferment for his missionary work in
France. "You hid behind your religion," Bannon said. 'Do not talk
to me about honor and integrity."____________________What about
Trump, Mr. Bannon? He didn't enlist during Vietnam either, now did he?
Romney never got my vote but character-wise he walks on water compared to Bannon
and Trump. When it is all said and done, the religious right will have a lot of
soul-searching to do. That doesn't mean they will do it.
I, too, would not vote for Mitt Romney. That said, he is a civil and respectable
person who seems to be one of the last reasonable voices in his party. He
recognises the toxicity of the Bannon faction, and the damage it is doing. He also recognises the need to place country over party, and to avoid the
likes of Moore at all costs. As for Bannon, if he wants to throw rocks,
Mitt Romney is not President. Find out if the guy who is served in Vietnam.
Bannon states: "You hid behind your religion," Bannon
said. 'Do not talk to me about honor and integrity."Speaking of "honor and integrity" and service to our country, how
about your hero "Commander in bone spurs"
What Bannon says is to a large degree what Trump thinks. They're
ideological soulmates.I hope all those Utahns who rejoiced at
Trump's gift to Utah on Monday with slashing the Bears Ears and GSE
monuments remember that Trump is far closer to Bannon in his world view than he
is to Orrin Hatch, or anyone else in Utah.Slashing the monuments was
a simple transactional event. The expectation is unquestioned loyalty.Utahns need to choose - do you bow down to Trump, or do you stand up for your
integrity, your heritage, (for LDS) your fellow Mormon.Or, do you
just pretend what was said in Alabama yesterday didn't happen, or you
didn't hear about it?
"If I'm in a foxhole, I don't want to know whether this guy next
to me is wondering if he's a woman or a man." What a crazy thing to
I didn’t vote for Mr. Romney. I’m a big D Democrat who doesn’t
like religion and isn’t exactly crazy about rich people in America. That
said, Mr. Romney is a man who cares about this country and who has the
intelligence to serve it. He is a good, decent man. Steve Bannen is a character
in a reality TV show called Donald Trumps’s America. He plays on the worst
fears and resentments of people and seeks only to tap into their hatred of
“the other”. Say what you want about Mitt—I never remember
him asking people to hate their fellow man.
""The days of taking it silently are over," Bannon declared at a
rally...".That is the mindset of many women also.
"The battle for the GOP's soul spilled into a dirt-floor barn deep in
rural Alabama."The soul of the GOP has found itself seeking
revitalisation among the strains of 'Dueling Banjos'. Where an accused
child molester finds support in his community. Maybe we should take a step
back and visualise this picture for a few moments.
The fact that Bannon, Trump and Utah politicians can support a guy like Roy
Moore is a testament to how low the GOP has fallen. Shame.